Not Sure Exactly Where To Post These Questions, So...

[Duraiken]

Yeah, I'm a noob. I like to hope that I'm a tad smarter and wiser than some noobs I've seen and met at other places ( :remembers the idiot who posted 'ilikepoopy' at several different message boards several times, shudders.: )

I've played StickRPG many, many times before (I knew of the game long before I even bothered trying to find out who actually made it.) I am an avid RPGer, even if I've never managed to do much real RPing, and have a great interest in writing fiction and computer (read: game) programming, but I've never been able to get much practice in any of these (except for playing RPGs like StickRPG, Dragon Court, Morrowind, Dragon Warrior 7, Shin Megami Tensei: Nocturne, and so on.)

I'm mainly here because I'd like to know if anyone here could give me an idea of where I could go to get a start at learning computer programming, ar at least point me to a game construction program actually makes SOME fraggin' sense! I've tried so many programs that're supposed to be easy to use that I'm getting sick and tired of it.

I'd also like to know if anyone could point me in the direction of a good freeware or shareware art/graphics program. I don't understand Pixia, I've given up trying to install GIMP, and I'm just not sure what else'd be any good. Help here'd be greatly appreciated (with either of these.) Thnx.

P.S.: if any part of my post or my avatar or whatnot has violated rules, please let me know and i'll fix it. i wasn't really sure where the rules for that kinda thing was other than the general behaviour post in Gen. Disc. and the '80x80' note above the avatar stuff. again, thnx.

[Hijacker27]

I'm mainly here because I'd like to know if anyone here could give me an idea of where I could go to get a start at learning computer programming, ar at least point me to a game construction program actually makes SOME fraggin' sense! I've tried so many programs that're supposed to be easy to use that I'm getting sick and tired of it.

we have a flash game dev section here, but that's for flash, but i think we also have some programming help, but i dunno much about that..

As for programs, you should try game maker -> http://www.gamemaker.nl
it's free for the base program, which works for 2D games, and then you can pay $20 for some more powerful stuff...

I'd also like to know if anyone could point me in the direction of a good freeware or shareware art/graphics program. I don't understand Pixia, I've given up trying to install GIMP, and I'm just not sure what else'd be any good. Help here'd be greatly appreciated (with either of these.) Thnx.


Try Paint :P,



P.S.: if any part of my post or my avatar or whatnot has violated rules, please let me know and i'll fix it. i wasn't really sure where the rules for that kinda thing was other than the general behaviour post in Gen. Disc. and the '80x80' note above the avatar stuff. again, thnx.

Nope, i don't think you've broken any rules at all :D congrats, if all newbies we're like you, everybody would be happy :D

[Duraiken]

we have a flash game dev section here, but that's for flash, but i think we also have some programming help, but i dunno much about that..

Thanks, I'll check those out then.

As for programs, you should try game maker -> http://www.gamemaker.nl
it's free for the base program, which works for 2D games, and then you can pay $20 for some more powerful stuff...

I've used Gamemaker before but I didn't really do much with it once I downloaded it; my younger brother uses it to play games developed on it, but he doesn't do much with it either. I guess I'll try taking another look at it. I'm mainly interested in making a complicated RPG, so I'm not sure if that's what I need. Oh well...

Try Paint

I was hoping for something with more options... Don't get me wrong, Paint is good for simple stuff, but I don't know how to get more sophisticated pictures out of it. I know it can be done (I've seen some pretty goods that were done with Paint and similar not very sophisticated programs, ) but I was hoping for something where I woudn't need quite as much effort. Besides, I definitely don't have the skills or patience needed to get the kind of results I want from Paint or similar programs, at least, not yet. Oh, well I'll keep looking.

Nope, i don't think you've broken any rules at all congrats, if all newbies we're like you, everybody would be happy

Thanks. While I'm new here, I've been around alot of different boards, mainly ones to do with fanfiction writing, so I know at the very least the basics of board etiquette. I'll be sure to brush up on the local variant when I get the chance.

Again, thanks for the help.

[Hijacker27]

Yeah, for the game maker thingie, if you know how to do scripting, you can do RPGish things pretty eaisly.. As far as i know...

And for drawing programs, go grab a free trial of photoshop, the best drawing program out there... Even though it's ALOT of money if you want to actually but it...

[Duraiken]

Yeah, for the game maker thingie, if you know how to do scripting, you can do RPGish things pretty eaisly.. As far as i know...

Really? I have something fairly complex planned, to be truthful. Wait a minute...

I described it in the entirety of what I have for it so far in my most recent journal entry at livejournal.com (which I need to start updating more often, darnit. ) It's very lengthy, so if anyone wants to just quit here, I won't fault them.

Imagine, if you will, a game that absolutely DOES not have a single, set-in-stone storyline, doesn't even have a series of storylines. Instead, you start out the game as a nobody, trying to make your way in the world. You go out in the fields, fight monsters, go back to town, rest and heal up, hire some some merc.s, go adventure farther than you did the "day" before, check into a nearby inn and rest and heal, listen to the pleas of a local villager about some local problem and decide whether to a) help or b) not help or c) just kill the poor sob and rob the village blind or d) say yes, but tell the villager that if you defeat the monster then as tribute the villagers must give you one of their young maidens so that you may bed her and keep her as a concubine or e)just forget the villager and go do something else, and then, if you're going to help, go find the beast and either a) kill it and 1. make stuff out of its hide or or teeth or tail or all of that stuff 2. sanctify its body and send its spirt to the afterlife 3. try to do 1 and 2 and end up with a cursed item that has the creaure's spirit bound to it, endlessly yelling at you, peeved off for you screwing up one simple ritual cause you got greedy or b)capture it and keep it as your own and maybe name it Fido or Butch or Lassie or something, or c)seal it in the cave or whatever the lair is so that you can back later when it stronger/you are stornger to destroy it. Then you go back to the village and listen to the people declaring you as their hero, and, as they ask you to give a speech, you decide to either a) claim it was something any good-hearted man would do and 1. accept the gifts the village lavishes on you 2. decline the gifts saying that it is your mission as a true hero to set the land fee from the pointless evil that has held reign over all the known lands for too long and try to recruit troops from among the villagers or b)ask for a small tract of land so that you may finally have a place to call your own or c) say that, as their hero the villagers must give you one of their young maidens each year so that you may bed her and keep her as a concubine or d)etc. You see what I'm getting at? Heck even if you did pick the "settle down" option, you'd still have to actually decide how to get your house built or just do it yourself, and then actually DO IT, and then if you eventually decide to marry, decide whether your character is doing it for love or just want to have an heir or just to have someone to bed. Heck, if you wanted to, you could even take a domesticated monster, or a not so desticated one, as your mate if it was close enough to human (maybe even if it wasn't,) deciding for your character whether it's because you've fallen in love with your "companion" or if it's because you want to breed a strong line of children that you can play as/have in your party once they're old enough, etc., etc. And then, once your kids are born, or adopt if you don't take a wife or whatever, you can decide whether or not to send them to school, what they'll learn, maybe have them get jobs to help earn some of the money (note- yes, I am stealing stuff from the Princess Maker 2 game for this, but I'd like to think you'd get more and less control over everything/get to decide what you want to control and what to leave up to fate or your character,) and when they come of age, maybe either let them decide what they want to do with their lives or decide for them, anything from setting them up in an arranged marriage so that you can cement an alliance or settle an agreement between families or breed for strength or magic powers or posession of a great artifact or item or something (I can just see it now; "But Dad, I don't want to marry that monster!" and then have an enormous and really ugly ogre walk in wearing a gigantic tux and holding a weed bouqet, or maybe... "Father, there is no way that I'm going to wed that senile, peverted little old freak!" and then have Happosai from the Ranma 1/2 anime/manga waltz on in and say "Hotcha! Come on girl, let's skip the wedding and get to the bedding, I wanna make some babies!") or let the kid search for romance on their own, or deny them the chance and watch them pull a Romeo & Juliet on you, or maybe they'll want to go adventuring with you to prove they can be your heir(s.) Or maybe have one of your kids launch an evil plot (TM) against you, seeking to poison you or something so that they won't have to listen to you ranting anymore ("Why, when I was your age, there were monsters around every corner, and you had to be careful of the trees getting up out of the ground and stomping on you, and dragons came down from the mounains every season to bed, err, eat the young maidens. Yeah, can't let 'em know that was me. Heh.") And then you could always go out adventuring again and end up camping in the forest only to find a nymph crying nearby a fallen oak and you decide whether or not to to hear her out, and if you do, you can then hunt down the men who chopped down her home, force them to give back the posessions they stole from her and help build a new home and then either a)tell her that it was all in a day's work or b)accept her offer to bed her and leave the forest the next day, fondly remembering your time with her, when she really wanted you to take option c)bed her and take her back to your home and declare her to be your concubine and Head Mistress. Yeah, I know, I've got a very sick mind. [/size]

A bit modified from what I originally wrote, but that's my idea. If it isn't already obvious I have a perverted streak that I am trying to balalnce with a decidedly large intolerance for may things related to perversion ( I really don't think I'm doing too well there...) Anywho, that's my rpg idea. I had another one...

My other main idea for a computer program/game is a World Generation/Simulation Program where you decide everything about the world, including what NOT to decide, and then let the program run and watch your world move from day to day or year to year or decade to decade or century to century or etc., etc., etc. I mean think about it, we could finally see what happen in Lord of the Rings after the Third Age, after the fall of Sauron and Mordor or watch the progression of the Clone Wars, watching each and every single battle, not just the main one.

If Gamemaker really can help me realize my freelance RPG, good, but I don't know if it could be used to make my world sim. That's the main reason I want to learn to prgram. I've had the idea for the world sim for a long, long time, and I'd really like to see if it can be done.

P.S.: sorry if the post was a bit long, btw.

[Sperry]

yes, that post was; long. i read it. try bumping the font up to normal before you submit it so my poor eyes have a fair chance reading it. :)

a very interesting little idea. the first thing that came to my mind was that it was almos parallel (though actually quite different, as it's a computer game, and well you can see things rather than imagine them...) to an old (but strangely still popular game) called dungeons and dragons. you run around doing well, hero stuff; and you choose where to go (to a degree, you are somewhat choiceless) and yah, if you don't find a wife/husband to make wee kiddies then your line ends and that's it for you...blablabla

it seems as though it's a borderline this and path games, where there are a series of defined paths you may take depending on your actions in day to day virtual existance. you're taking on a lot to say that you want to be able to design the town and then rule it or whatnot, let alone an entire world! to do this i think you'd have to either have a random terrain generator or the can make their world like a puzzle. a chunk of river there, water, water, land, forest and so on. and you would have to have it begin some time in. otherwise, "you are an ape; don't die for a couple hundred thousand years and you get to the fun part"

just a reminder, there are ways to know what happens after the fall of Sauran. it's told in many little nooks and crannies... (i don't think there is a book about the events post-mordor, but do correct me if i am in error) yah, pretty much i'm sorry to say to all you middle earth fanatics that sauran was a pawn really. his master's off doing things bla bla bla...and the fourth age is sort of irrelevant. after a while either all the fellowship goes off on boats (i'm pretty sure it's frodo, gandalf, legolas, and gimili that do gimli) or they die in middle earth. (boromir is dead, aragorn will, and then the three other hobbits) i'm not sure about m+p if they boat or not... i think they do or they die early because sam's the last one kicking in middle earth...

good ideas. i think they just need to be pulled away from the usuals.

[bobmasedo]

depends if you go by the book or movie, I dont think the movie tells you what happens to Saruman you just have to imagine it says in the book though

At the end Frodo goes off on a boat to a place I cant remember the name of, aragon ,gimli,legolas I cant remember but I think go off together and the non-frodo/bilbo hobbits go back to the shire
I really need to read the books again

A world designer would be hard to do and the first one is basically Fable just alot bigger

These remind me of my brothers idea for a ball game maker game

[-Scratch]

As for the art/graphics program:

http://www.photofiltre.com/

Try it. It looks pretty good, definately better than paint... :D

[Sperry]

in the book the sauruman (spelling???) is dealt with in the second, but he takes over hobbiton by the third. (then he dies) you only see sauruman in the extended version of the movie. he dies in the wrong time but tough luck.

it's called the "undying lands". aragorn reigns as king until he dies in good old gondor. gimili and legolas go off later in their own boats after peeking about middle earth. frodo/bilbo and the last of the decent elves other than legolas leave middle earth on that boat, along with mithrandir i believe (gandalf) merry and peregrin die some time or another...while sam is mayor of hobbiton 7 times until he dies. "thus ends the fellowship"

how do i know all this? why i read the appendices of course!

[Duraiken]

Okay, one thing at a time.

yes, that post was; long. i read it. try bumping the font up to normal before you submit it so my poor eyes have a fair chance reading it

The main reason I made it smaller was in a vain hope that doing so would make sure the post didn't break the word limit (there is a word limit, isn't there?)

a very interesting little idea. the first thing that came to my mind was that it was almos parallel (though actually quite different, as it's a computer game, and well you can see things rather than imagine them...) to an old (but strangely still popular game) called dungeons and dragons. you run around doing well, hero stuff; and you choose where to go (to a degree, you are somewhat choiceless) and yah, if you don't find a wife/husband to make wee kiddies then your line ends and that's it for you...blablabla

it seems as though it's a borderline this and path games, where there are a series of defined paths you may take depending on your actions in day to day virtual existance. you're taking on a lot to say that you want to be able to design the town and then rule it or whatnot, let alone an entire world! to do this i think you'd have to either have a random terrain generator or the can make their world like a puzzle. a chunk of river there, water, water, land, forest and so on. and you would have to have it begin some time in. otherwise, "you are an ape; don't die for a couple hundred thousand years and you get to the fun part"

Heh. While my original intent wasn't to make a direct computer conversion of D&D I can see how you'd think that. You're also right, though, in that I want my game to be less limited/linear than sessions in D&D sometimes turn out to be. While my experience with p&p games like D&D is extremely limited, I am an avid enough follower of them that I at least know some of the basics. I want my game to practically be a world, in and of itself, where the players can whatever their hearts desire. I realize a project of that kind of scope could be impossible to truly finish, though that might not necessarily be a problem if I can keep my interest in it. Heh, thanks for the advice.

A world designer would be hard to do and the first one is basically Fable just alot bigger

Yeah, I know that a World Designer would be hard to do; that's why I said in one of my earlier posts that I doubted Gamemaker would be able to do it. As for the first idea being like a bigger version of Fable, feh. Fable has no replay value; you can get all the secrets in the game one time through, and changing what you do the second time makes just about no difference to gameplay. My idea is different in that just about every action you make changes how your character looks at things, and if there are enough witnesses, how your character is viewed by NPCs. Also, as I stated earlier, you can choose to settle down at any time just about anywhere, whether as a king or as a peasant or whatnot. The recruitment option is also something that, so far as I know, has never been doe; basically, there will not be a single character in the game you won't have a chance, however slim it might be to recruit; whether it be man or woman, monster or villain. Continuing your adventures as one of your character's children if your main character bites the bucket is likely also something not usually done in freelance rpgs. And so on and so forth.

As for the art/graphics program:

http://www.photofiltre.com/

Try it. It looks pretty good, definately better than paint...

I actually already do have photofiltre, and a whole host of other programs, but I wasn't aware photogiltre had art capabilities; I've just been using it to make my pictures bigger, smaller, and clearer/cleaner. Huh. Feh; anyway, my main problem with the freeware programs and such I have is that I don't know how to use them very well. At least that's what I think.

just a reminder, there are ways to know what happens after the fall of Sauran. it's told in many little nooks and crannies... (i don't think there is a book about the events post-mordor, but do correct me if i am in error) yah, pretty much i'm sorry to say to all you middle earth fanatics that sauran was a pawn really. his master's off doing things bla bla bla...and the fourth age is sort of irrelevant. after a while either all the fellowship goes off on boats (i'm pretty sure it's frodo, gandalf, legolas, and gimili that do gimli) or they die in middle earth. (boromir is dead, aragorn will, and then the three other hobbits) i'm not sure about m+p if they boat or not... i think they do or they die early because sam's the last one kicking in middle earth...

I think this is where I messed up. My world generator idea is a completely separate one from my freelance rpg idea, and by itself I don't want it to have any link to Lord of the Rings. I was just using that as an example of the things that, if I can get it off the ground, should be possible with it. You could recreate your favorite books or movies or change them in a subtle fashion to see what might've happened if, for example, Peter Parker already knew how to fight before he got bitten by that radioactive spider, or maybe continue cancelled or finished shows or movies or such: maybe find out what happened to Kolchak the Night Stalker after the first season was over (they only made one, stupid producers and such,) or what happened to Buffy from the Buffy the Vampire Slayer after the end of the series.

Well, tell me whatcha think, and, again, sorry if I foolishly broke any rules.

[Sperry]

there is a word limit to your signature. posts can be long so long as they are pointful. they are limited only because it is rather hard to design an entire world and then say "go where you want". if you can put enough effort into this it will turn out to be a great success. if it's a computer game; like online i mean, something of this length demands a save or people will have very pained necks/wrists.

[The Brown Cow]

I personally don't think we can have a truely open-ended game without full-body VR and some sort of text/speech interpreter. It's still going to come down to a selection of options at some point.

[bobmasedo]

it would be pretty hard, you might be able to do it on a smaller scale like a village or something but I dunno

[Duraiken]

Which is why said that while I know it could be a nearly impossible task, I'm still going to try... once I learn how to program in a (programming) language/format that I could make it work in/on.

[Sperry]

i think regardless of the size of the game, from what i understand you're going to want to focus on two very important things; the storyline and the difficulty. via the storyline, it must either be funny or very deep. there should be complexity and whatnot, and more than one affect is resulting, so "if you choose the green bottle" you don't always die. with difficulty, i am referring to getting your hero or whatever dude off the ground. it doesn't necessarily have to be easy, but how to do it should be apparant after some exploration. most games like this you go for a few minutes then get stuck like "i can't find the magic toy" or whatever. don't make then be able to waltz through it, but make the game possible to find a way out.
other things are important, but no one plays the impossible "you're here live with it" games.

[bobmasedo]

and replay value

[mbm_670]

that game is hard

[Sperry]

are you referring to dnd? or something else? please furthur explain.