Chivalry is DEAD.

[Screech]

Chivalry is the ideals associated with Knighthood in medieval times. It is a simple way of acting and respecting things around you.


The Ten Commandments of the Code of Chivalry

From Chivalry by Leon Gautier

Thou shalt believe all that the Church teaches, and shalt observe all its directions.
Thou shalt defend the Church.
Thou shalt repect all weaknesses, and shalt constitute thyself the defender of them.
Thou shalt love the country in the which thou wast born.
Thou shalt not recoil before thine enemy.
Thou shalt make war against the Infidel without cessation, and without mercy.
Thou shalt perform scrupulously thy feudal duties, if they be not contrary to the laws of God.
Thou shalt never lie, and shall remain faithful to thy pledged word.
Thou shalt be generous, and give largess to everyone.
Thou shalt be everywhere and always the champion of the Right and the Good against Injustice and Evil.

The Code of Chivalry

From the Rifts: England Supplement

I'm pretty sure I got this list somewhere else, but I haven't found out where. Still, some reference is better than none, so thanks to Jeremy Treanor for giving me this one.

Live to serve King and Country.
Live to defend Crown and Country and all it holds dear.
Live one's life so that it is worthy of respect and honor.
Live for freedom, justice and all that is good.
Never attack an unarmed foe.
Never use a weapon on an opponent not equal to the attack.
Never attack from behind.
Avoid lying to your fellow man.
Avoid cheating.
Avoid torture.
Obey the law of king, country, and chivalry.
Administer justice.
Protect the innocent.
Exhibit self control.
Show respect to authority.
Respect women.
Exhibit Courage in word and deed.
Defend the weak and innocent.
Destroy evil in all of its monstrous forms.
Crush the monsters that steal our land and rob our people.
Fight with honor.
Avenge the wronged.
Never abandon a friend, ally, or noble cause.
Fight for the ideals of king, country, and chivalry.
Die with valor.
Always keep one's word of honor.
Always maintain one's principles.
Never betray a confidence or comrade.
Avoid deception.
Respect life and freedom.
Die with honor.
Exhibit manners.
Be polite and attentive.
Be respectful of host, women, and honor.
Loyalty to country, King, honor, freedom, and the code of chivalry.
Loyalty to one's friends and those who lay their trust in thee.


Is Chivalry dead?

[WaterZoma]

Most of it is. Some of it isn't.

[Drifterxkringo]

I truly believe it is. There are some whose morals are fairly similair to the laws and teachings of chivalry, but almost everyone in our modern-day world has forgotten about good morals, honour, loyalty, etc. Most attempt to make a living, and in the process, forget what their morals were. So, Yes, It is dead.

[The Prodigal]

Chivalry is like a pair of shackles.

It screws your freedom and forces you to be ultimately selfless. I can't make myself be selfless, when I see everyone around me being selfish. If I do be selfless, all the potential benefit is taken by those who do not need it, taken by those who crave it. That's how society works.

It's not all dead. People certainly respect women, and alot of people live justly, among other things in that list.

If there was not a speck of chivalry in the world, it would be pure chaos.

[Tanktunker]

Uhhhhh....Chivalry is concept of knighthood, first and foremost, and since that queenie ##### is still calling people "Sir", then no, Chivalry is still dead.
But the code of Chivalry? Well, we have Ned Flanders and Orgazmo for that one.
Kinda.

[The Prodigal]

Uhhhhh....Chivalry is concept of knighthood,

No it isn't. True it began as an honor code for knights, but Chivalry totally adheres to modern life.

That's why it's still around today. It's a good foundation for people to build their lives on.

[Vagrant]

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Game_theory

I was just reading up on Game Theory today. Chivalry sounds remarkably like pure altruism, which is a poor strategy, because it will often be exploited. I'd say it's pretty much dead, because nobody like to be constantly exploited.

[Leperkawn]

-puts my coat in puddle in front of thread-

After you, jo/mara/any other girl here.

-motions at thread-

[Screech]

I'd say it's pretty much dead, because nobody like to be constantly exploited.

The final goal of Chivalry is to die with honour. Since it is a personal moral goal, even if you still lose you still have reached the goal. Today people will still try stick with their personal goals through no end. Exploitation doesn't really come in play in my opinion- the decline of Chivalry is more of a switch in society's morals and views than anything else.

Also, is it really a bad thing some parts of Chivalry are dead?

6- Thou shalt make war against the Infidel without cessation, and without mercy.

Lovely?

[Tanktunker]

Bush "crusades", so that's not gone.

[Doug05257]

Also, is it really a bad thing some parts of Chivalry are dead?
Lovely?
Of course you could always take that from a non-literal point of view.

As in withholding support/finances/whatever from those in the wrong in order to help those who are right.

Or something. Forgive me, this is a 3:30 AM post. xD

[DarkReality]

The final goal of Chivalry is to die with honour. Since it is a personal moral goal, even if you still lose you still have reached the goal. Today people will still try stick with their personal goals through no end. Exploitation doesn't really come in play in my opinion- the decline of Chivalry is more of a switch in society's morals and views than anything else.

Honor no longer plays such a big role in our world. Back then, honor was the greatest thing you could have. It gave you respect from people and made you feel good. And let's be honest, once someone was a knight, there was very little they could have still achieved. They pretty much reached the top of the food chain without being royalty. So what did they do? They lived an honorable life to not only feel good about themselves but to also help others who aren't in their position.

But nowadays, there is no "top of the food chain". We can constantly advance, earn more money, be even richer, etc. Personal goals are more important nowadays because we are no longer bound to a caste system (once a peasant, always a peasant). We can achieve virtually any goal we want to, and that's the decline of chivalry. Our selfishness and the ability to become modern-day royalty (celebrities, incredibly rich people, etc) without being born that way killed chivalry.

In any case, chivalry wasn't what it was made out to be. Knights were usually a lot more cruel when it came to their own peasants and lands. Chivalry usually existed only in the upper classes and on paper. Otherwise, wars would have been nonexistant :-)

[Hex]

Chivalry played a large part in Feudalism, and, since Feudalism was doomed from the start, Chivalry went with it.

[Tanktunker]

And let's be honest, once someone was a knight, there was very little they could have still achieved. They pretty much reached the top of the food chain without being royalty.
Considering that the only people that were knights were some sort of royalty (Heir to Duke/Lord/King/Whatever) or at the very least, part of the Arisocratic class, there wasn't anything to do at that point, at all, as claiming land wouldn't "up" you, since you or one of your relatives prolly owned so much land that you'll get immense quantaties of it through inheritence.

[Freddy]

you know a lot of those codes you listed I cant even do if I wanted to.
I have no king, Im not a knight (or a modern equivilent to one), I dont carry a weapon, Im an athiest and Im no patriot.

I do uphold almost everything else though.

[Rob97]

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Game_theory

I was just reading up on Game Theory today. Chivalry sounds remarkably like pure altruism, which is a poor strategy, because it will often be exploited. I'd say it's pretty much dead, because nobody like to be constantly exploited.
Same. Chivalry is a wonderfull way to live, but it will never work because people will always take advantage of it.

[brothad]

its kind of against the law now to follow that to the tee, i mean im not saying i would do this but if i followed those laws i would set my goal in life to kill all non christians, and most people that would do that (i e hitler) are now considered crazy, so chivalry is dead, its just locked away in sunnyvale sanitarium.

[Arca]

Live to serve King and Country. DEAD
Live to defend Crown and Country and all it holds dear. DEAD
Live one's life so that it is worthy of respect and honor. DEAD
Live for freedom, justice and all that is good. DEAD
Never attack an unarmed foe. Alive (at least sometimes)
Never use a weapon on an opponent not equal to the attack. DEAD
Never attack from behind. Alive usually...
Avoid lying to your fellow man. DEAD
Avoid cheating. DEAD
Avoid torture. Alive
Obey the law of king, country, and chivalry. DEAD
Administer justice. Alive
Protect the innocent. Alive
Exhibit self control. Alive (most of the time)
Show respect to authority.DEAD
Respect women. Alive Alive Alive Alive Alive Alive (don't be a Ass! If you wants some... Kidding)
Exhibit Courage in word and deed. Alive
Defend the weak and innocent. Alive
Destroy evil in all of its monstrous forms.DEAD (I can't destroy myself)
Crush the monsters that steal our land and rob our people. DEAD Umm Imigrants?
Fight with honor. Alive
Avenge the wronged. Alive
Never abandon a friend, ally, or noble cause. Alive
Fight for the ideals of king, country, and chivalry. DEAD
Die with valor. Alive
Always keep one's word of honor. Alive
Always maintain one's principles. Alive Welll... My priciples aren't that hard to maintain
Never betray a confidence or comrade. Alive
Avoid deception. DEAD
Respect life and freedom. Alive
Die with honor. Alive
Exhibit manners. DEAD DEAD DEAD DEAD
Be polite and attentive. DEAD
Be respectful of host, women, and honor. Alive
Loyalty to country, King, honor, freedom, and the code of chivalry. DEAD
Loyalty to one's friends and those who lay their trust in thee.Alive Alive Alive
Well thats me! Ateast what I believe in.... for now

[DarkReality]

Crush the monsters that steal our land and rob our people. DEAD Umm Imigrants?

...

Yea, damn americans. I can't understand why the natives didn't slaughter you yet -_-

[brothad]

because america has like the best military (them & israel)

[Tanktunker]

We have the second best military?!
Well, thanks for letting me know that other countries that would crush us pretty much instantly don't have a better military than us.

[brothad]

we have probably the second most funding, just not the best tactics.

[Kevim]

because america has like the best military (them & israel)
Are you seriously comparing The United States of America's Military to Israel's? ...Okay, let us put it this way. The ENTIRE NATION of Israel has approximently 7 million people. Alright? The United States of America's MILITARY has 2.5 million people. Need I say more?

p.s. Just an opinion. But I'd say Iran, Russia, The People's Republic of China, and The United States of America have the best militaries in the world.

Anyways...
Honor no longer plays such a big role in our world. Back then, honor was the greatest thing you could have. It gave you respect from people and made you feel good. And let's be honest, once someone was a knight, there was very little they could have still achieved. They pretty much reached the top of the food chain without being royalty. So what did they do? They lived an honorable life to not only feel good about themselves but to also help others who aren't in their position.

But nowadays, there is no "top of the food chain". We can constantly advance, earn more money, be even richer, etc. Personal goals are more important nowadays because we are no longer bound to a caste system (once a peasant, always a peasant). We can achieve virtually any goal we want to, and that's the decline of chivalry. Our selfishness and the ability to become modern-day royalty (celebrities, incredibly rich people, etc) without being born that way killed chivalry.

In any case, chivalry wasn't what it was made out to be. Knights were usually a lot more cruel when it came to their own peasants and lands. Chivalry usually existed only in the upper classes and on paper. Otherwise, wars would have been nonexistant :-)
This is basically my opinion but if I were to type it it would be much shorter and not have as many big words. Anyways, I would say Chivalry is pretty much dead. I'm not saying that mannors or morals or ethics are dead though. Just as our little German friend said, people don't need Chivalry to feell good/more important. We can always make ourselves richer/better/more powerful. There isn't any need for Chivalry.

[brothad]

oh ya forgot about china they can automatically draft about 250 million people if a big war starts.

[Vagrant]

oh ya forgot about china they can automatically draft about 250 million people if a big war starts.

"Hey guys, you think we can arm all these 250 million citizens and train them how to use a gun efficiently in less than a week or two?"

It doesn't work that way.

[StickAvalancheman]

I open doors for people and make an effort to pull out chairs and in general, make activities easier for all regardless of gender. As far as offering ones jacket goes, that seems to be more of an intimate activity rather than a courteous one. If it's just me and a group of friends out somewhere in the cold, chances are I'd be cold if I ditched my jacket, so I'd probobly keep it.

[n00bsta]

Call me old fashion but I believe in Chivalry.

[Soon to be flash master]

I open doors for the ladies, however they never say thankyou anymore. That gets on my nerves, chivalry is only good when you get something in return, a smile, a thankyou, a nod, a response, a letter, an animation based on the Chivlistic act.

Chivalry is an egoistic act in my opinion.

[Alphaniner]

-puts my coat in puddle in front of thread-

After you, jo/mara/any other girl here.

-motions at thread-

*enters thread via Lep's coat.*

And I'm a dude! Ha! Now my feet are dry, and your coat is wet! Haha!

^^A good example of why chivalry died out.^^

People take advantage of you. Chivalry is all but dead. I mean I still hold doors and stuff like that for people, but it's more or less gone.

[DarkReality]

Are you seriously comparing The United States of America's Military to Israel's? ...Okay, let us put it this way. The ENTIRE NATION of Israel has approximently 7 million people. Alright? The United States of America's MILITARY has 2.5 million people. Need I say more?

China has 1.5 billion people. What mind of army do you think they can mobilize if they started a general draft and trained the people? Your 2.5 million would be pale compared to them. And apart from that, the chinese already have 2.5 million soldiers. Or so.

Size != quality. Countless battles during the greco-roman period can verify that.

p.s. Just an opinion. But I'd say Iran, Russia, The People's Republic of China, and The United States of America have the best militaries in the world.

...

Israel really DOES have some of the best trained soldiers. Considering their training is absolutely ruthless. Or so I'm told. Once you're finished with school there, you have to serve for 3 years in the military (and this is not pulled out of my ass, my girlfriend has friends in Israel she met during a student exchange. All of them are currently in the military. Even the women).

"Hey guys, you think we can arm all these 250 million citizens and train them how to use a gun efficiently in less than a week or two?"

It doesn't work that way.

You KNOW America would be more than willing to sell them 250 million guns. Imagine the financial boost. And the diplomatic boost. And if America doesn't, then Russia will. China will get their guns one way or another. And if they're cheap AK's from 1950. And as to using them: 3 months is enough to train someone. In germany, we have a compulsory military service that lasts for 9 months (yea, it's that short). After 3 months, you could technically be used to defend germany because you'd have finished your basic training.

And I'm sure that if chinese methods are used, those 3 months become 6 weeks.

Chivalry is an egoistic act in my opinion.

Chivalry is the act of doing these things WITHOUT expecting anything in return. Doing so and expecting a girl to give you head for opening the door for her isn't chivalry.

[Screech]

Size != quality. Countless battles during the greco-roman period can verify that.

not anymore. With modern weapons, sizes mean nothing as they can easily be killed off if they are not armed. For example, the Russians in WWII. They had a huge army, but were easily killed off. Old taticts of sending wave after wave of people nolonger work in modern wars.

[Vagrant]

And I'm sure that if chinese methods are used, those 3 months become 6 weeks.


That's plenty of time for a blitz by America or another country to get into China.

With modern weapons, sizes mean nothing as they can easily be killed off if they are not armed. For example, the Russians in WWII. They had a huge army, but were easily killed off. Old taticts of sending wave after wave of people nolonger work in modern wars.

That was his point. The Romans and Greeks had some of the best trained troops in existence for their time. The Romans were literal steamrollers through barbarians because they were well trained and equipped. A tower shield and a gladius are very easy to wield compared to an axe, longsword, broadsword, and/or buckler. Plus, the Romans had several group tactics and preliminary foe weakening tactics. And the Romans were well organized.

In other words, quality can make a huge difference. It was only when the barbarians got horses and started learning Roman military tactics did Rome's military crumble. And that was Western Rome. Eastern Rome lasted up until the fall of Constantinople in 1450.

In the strength of the Roman Empire, the only two regions to truely hold off the Romans were Northern England and the Germanic tribes.

[Leperkawn]

*enters thread via Lep's coat.*

And I'm a dude! Ha! Now my feet are dry, and your coat is wet! Haha!

^^A good example of why chivalry died out.^^

People take advantage of you. Chivalry is all but dead. I mean I still hold doors and stuff like that for people, but it's more or less gone.

-knifes you from behind-

-puts your body over my wet coat-

HAH!

[Rob97]

Like I said, chivalry is based on a code of honor. Chivalry also has some ties to religous values. Cheating on your wife and garbage like that. God played a big role in medieval times. Nowadays, god doesn't mean jack. I believe in a god, but I know a lot of people don't. With people not afraid of going to hell, they're gonna live their lives doing what ever they want.

- Honor in war is dead.
- Honor in love is dead.
- Religion is dying.
- Chivalry is dead.

The world's just going to **** if you ask me...

[Leperkawn]

Strength
Through
Unity
Unity
Through
Faith!

[Vagrant]

Like I said, chivalry is based on a code of honor. Chivalry also has some ties to religous values. Cheating on your wife and garbage like that.

Not cheating on your wife is not just a religious thing -- it's an evolutionary thing. A woman who has a child wants her man to stay true to her -- otherwise she'll be in a ####load of trouble if he runs off with another girl while she still has her child.

Loyalty and good genetics are the two primary things females of any mammalian/avian species look for. If their man is unfaithful, what do the good genes mean if they can't support the child? On the flip side, what good is a stunted, misshapen, retarded child (evolution-wise), no matter how well raised it is?

You'll find several species of birds that have males or females that cheat on their "spouses." If they're caught, they can be booted out or even killed. The same thing happens in many mammalian species.





Some social/religious/cultural things make more sense when you think about it in an Darwinist reasoning.

[Tanktunker]

Strength
Through
Unity
Unity
Through
Faith!
STUUTF?
Huh?

[DarkReality]

STFU!

Strength through faithful unity!

[Alphaniner]

-knifes you from behind-

-puts your body over my wet coat-

HAH!

Harsh. But Your coat is even wetter now. You're gonna catch pneumonia and die shortly. (Let's pretend it's January in Russia. Which means it would actually be ice, but whatever.

[h00pla]

- Honor in war is dead.
- Honor in love is dead.
- Religion is dying.
- Chivalry is dead.


I totally agree! I was playing Enemy Territory as a medic and even when I'm trying to help a dead soldier I get shot. Those 12 year olds have no honor whatsoever!

[Mafiaboy20]

Chivalry is the ideals associated with Knighthood in medieval times. It is a simple way of acting and respecting things around you.



Is Chivalry dead?

Much of it is, and most died before it even caught on...

[Kevim]

China has 1.5 billion people. What mind of army do you think they can mobilize if they started a general draft and trained the people? Your 2.5 million would be pale compared to them. And apart from that, the chinese already have 2.5 million soldiers. Or so.

Size != quality. Countless battles during the greco-roman period can verify that.

Israel really DOES have some of the best trained soldiers. Considering their training is absolutely ruthless. Or so I'm told. Once you're finished with school there, you have to serve for 3 years in the military (and this is not pulled out of my ass, my girlfriend has friends in Israel she met during a student exchange. All of them are currently in the military. Even the women).

I think you misread my post ol'-buddy-ol'-pal. I never said the USA had a greater military then China and I actually implied that size does = quality.

As for your second paragraph. Wow. I knew they had good soliders, but not that good. Anyways, what I am trying to say here is about one in ever 2 people in Israel would have to be enrolled in the military to have one as large as ours, and even then their military technologies aren't nearly as great.

Anyways.. yeah. Chivalry. It is so Chival and... stuff.

[Mafiaboy20]

I actually implied that size does = quality.

Its a wonder why Africa dosnt invade The US any day now...oh wait! they dont have boats!

[Karl]

The Ten Commandments of the Code of Chivalry

From Chivalry by Leon Gautier

Thou shalt believe all that the Church teaches, and shalt observe all its directions.
Thou shalt defend the Church.
Thou shalt repect all weaknesses, and shalt constitute thyself the defender of them.
Thou shalt love the country in the which thou wast born.
Thou shalt not recoil before thine enemy.
Thou shalt make war against the Infidel without cessation, and without mercy.
Thou shalt perform scrupulously thy feudal duties, if they be not contrary to the laws of God.
Thou shalt never lie, and shall remain faithful to thy pledged word.
Thou shalt be generous, and give largess to everyone.
Thou shalt be everywhere and always the champion of the Right and the Good against Injustice and Evil.
The Code of Chivalry

From the Rifts: England Supplement

I'm pretty sure I got this list somewhere else, but I haven't found out where. Still, some reference is better than none, so thanks to Jeremy Treanor for giving me this one.

Live to serve King and Country.
Live to defend Crown and Country and all it holds dear.
Live one's life so that it is worthy of respect and honor.
Live for freedom, justice and all that is good.
Never attack an unarmed foe.
Never use a weapon on an opponent not equal to the attack.
Never attack from behind.
Avoid lying to your fellow man.
Avoid cheating.
Avoid torture.
Obey the law of king, country, and chivalry.
Administer justice.
Protect the innocent.
Exhibit self control.
Show respect to authority.
Respect women.
Exhibit Courage in word and deed.
Defend the weak and innocent.
Destroy evil in all of its monstrous forms.
Crush the monsters that steal our land and rob our people.
Fight with honor.
Avenge the wronged.
Never abandon a friend, ally, or noble cause.
Fight for the ideals of king, country, and chivalry.
Die with valor.
Always keep one's word of honor.
Always maintain one's principles.
Never betray a confidence or comrade.
Avoid deception.
Respect life and freedom.
Die with honor.
Exhibit manners.
Be polite and attentive.
Be respectful of host, women, and honor.
Loyalty to country, King, honor, freedom, and the code of chivalry.
Loyalty to one's friends and those who lay their trust in thee.I try my best to do the ones I bolded. For the ones that I didn't:
1) I respect other people's religions. There's no such thing as an infidel.
2) I don't really have any fuedal duties, besides my obligations as a US citizen.
3) I admit I'm not very generous. I try to help where I can, but I get screwed too often when I loan out money.
4) I'm no champion. There's not much evil to destroy.

I'm not trying to be all high and mighty or anything. These are just things I believe in.

...My friends make fun of me for it :/