Which server side language to learn?

[Matt]

I really need to start working with servers along with Flash but don't know what I should learn or really how I should. See in Flash the results are generated right there in front of me, if there is a problem I can see it, or tell it to output information for me, etc etc. Should I learn php, python, java?

Where would I write the code for them and what are good compilers? which should I start with? What are some beginning things I should try to do with them and should I learn them individually first or go right into combining with Flash?

Basically I'm just asking for opinions on the matter, preferably from experiences rather than text book answers.

[Chris T]

I can't really speak for Python because I don't know it, but..

I recommend PHP for web development purposes, and Java for an actual server implementation.

Jon'll come by and recommend Python, I'm sure.. I gotta learn it soon.

[eedok]

python with the twisted library for sure

here's an old yet simple example: http://blog.pettomato.com/?p=9

[Matt]

Python first and php after? I'm going to need a small server to test on, time to find one.

[eedok]

any VPS will do

also I like python for web development over php, php doesn't have anything as usable as Django for making it easy :p

[truimagz]

I like php cuz it's easy and open sourced.

never used python though.

My setups are usually ... xml, php, as, mysql

[Pazil]

Hey truimagz, never knew you were here too!

Personally, I like sticking with PHP and...probably Java (gotta start learning that one).

I have no idea how Python works with/on a server...could someone please explain to me sometime?

[eedok]

sure read the link in reply #3

Also you guys should ditch the attitude of I haven't tried it, so it's probably bad, when in reality it's quite the opposite. Socket handling in python is so much easier than java due to dynamic lists, and better library support, and it works better for web pages as there's no "magic" like php(do you deal with registerglobals, magicquotes, and the fact that if you leave a new line before after the <? ?>'s php will output them, even when you already specified output isn't html), and also has better library support :p

[Pazil]

Well I certainly wasn't trying to say python's bad...I really was interested in it, since I've seen a few socket servers written with it. Do you have any performance comparisons with it and Java?

[eedok]

here's another link to read: http://scientificninja.com/advice/the-dangers-of-benchmarks

[arkhan]

Then Ill stand up for java and say that the red5 support of the rtmp protocol(cant reallu remember if thats the protocol..but its rt something..long time I dont use it) makes it the bet choice in real time interaction with flash.

Then its just up to decide if you are going to use this awsome protocol or sockets/other kind of interaction (Totally not taking any sides here)

In my opinion its just not worthy to make a chat with red5, and for any simpler interaction I would say python is the best choice.

using the java background is just an excuse for the red5 server..it could be lingo or lolcode running behind the scene..its just another language to make the server side..The very point of it is that it uses the authoritary protocol and enables for really smooth interaction..

setting it up and the cost to run it on a server is another question...It really changes alot depending on the scope and resources of the project.

[magcius]

Python definitely... PyAMF and Twisted are what I would use....

But this requires that you need to know how networking works overall (ports, sockets, protocols like TCP/UDP)

[game-bot]

This is a good program for testing php locally - http://www.zachsaw.co.cc/?pg=quickphp_php_tester_debugger&sub=quickphp_php_tester_debugger_moreinfo

Unzip it somewhere, write up something in php, and go to http://127.0.0.1:5723/.

[eedok]

XAMPP is better :P

[Jonanin]

PHP is very easy to use in a shared environment and will work with most hosts. Python is much harder to use effectively without your own server or VPS. Still, I like Python as a language much better.

Also, Twisted sucks. You have to do crap like:

internet.TCPServer(7779, IFingerFactory(f)).setServiceParent(
service.IServiceCollection(application))

It just doesn't work for me. It's probably opposite of what you would like, too, Matt. I am actually working on a project that might interest you as far as python and servers and flash go.

[magcius]

Jonanin, those two lines aren't a reason you don't use a library. If it does 90% of the work, science forbid you have you create a TCP server and a factory. You're mostly just dismissing an entire library for two lines you don't like (guess what, I don't like them either). No massive library like Twisted or Django is going to keep everyone happy. Your job as a computer programmer is to use the tools you have available, even if you have to work around the bad (and what's bad is mostly opinion, so it's something that can''t please both teams). They're working on new APIs as well (a quick-start like internet.quickStartTCP(7779, f, application) )

[Jonanin]

It's not the two lines I hate... those lines are just an example of why I hate it. I don't need an IApplication with an IFactory and IServiceCollections. I just want something that helps keep me out of the lower levels of TCP. Write and read. Maybe a nice event system. And please stop insulting my programming and teamwork skills because I hate the library you so dearly love. And if the tools available don't fit my needs, I can write my own if I damn well please. People getting fed up with the existing tool is probably how a lot of new and great libraries get made. And I'm not on a two month time constraint, either. So I can write it at my leisure.